233. Stanley Payne on The Spanish Civil War, The Soviet Union, and Communism
1h 21m | Jul 17, 2026In this episode, we welcome back Dr. Stanley Payne to discuss his book The Spanish Civil War, The Soviet Union, and Communism. The Spanish Civil War is “the most mythified civil war of the twentieth century.” Commonly misunderstood and distorted into a conflict of “Democracy” versus “Fascism”, the truth involves a revolutionary-counter-revolutionary struggle, more akin to a post-WWI political crisis than a prelude to WWII. Yet, the “grand camouflage” representing propaganda rather than history persists. How do we get at the truth of what actually happened and sift fact from fiction? How do we know the Spanish revolution actually happened – and what led to it? Indeed, what would likely have occurred (or kept occurring) had not General Francisco Franco began the military insurrection on July 18, 1936? Moreover, Communist involvement in Spain, and Soviet policy regarding the Spanish Civil War has been “the major mystery” of the conflict. What were the “real goals” of Soviet policy in the Spanish war, and what light has been shed by the documents available after the fall of the Soviet Union? Listen in as Dr. Payne takes us through the grand chessboard of Soviet goals and politics – and how Spain fit into those goals and plans. Though the primary goal is to get the history of the period right – it turns out there are lessons to be learned, even for today.
Book: The Spanish Civil War, The Soviet Union, and Communism
Other resources by Dr. Payne:
- hear our previous interview here
The Collapse of the Republic, 1933-1936: Origins of the Civil War
Franco: A Personal and Political Biography
Franco and Hitler: Spain, Germany and WWII
A History of Fascism, 1914-1945
Spain: A Unique History
Other resources:
Fascism: Career of a Concept; Antifascism: The Course of a Crusade by Paul Gottfried
Lenin: The Man, the Dictator, and the Master of Terror by Victor Sebestyan
Stalin, Volume I: Paradoxes of Power, 1878-1928; Stalin, Volume II: Waiting for Hitler, 1929-1941 by Stephen Kotkin (also here, here, here and here)
