De Dépendance Podcast addresses the complex issues of our time and how they manifest themselves in our cities and urban regions. From Rotterdam, The Netherlands we interview writers, scholars, and thought leaders.

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How rich is too rich? In this episode, we revisit a conversation recorded at De Dépendance in 2024 with philosopher Ingrid Robeyns and economic historian Guido Alfani, two leading thinkers on wealth, inequality, and the history of capitalism.The discussion took place on the occasion of the publication of Robeyns&#39; book Limitarianism: The Case Against Extreme Wealth and Alfani&#39;s As Gods Among Men: A History of the Rich in the West. Together, these books ask a pressing question: what happens when extreme riches become concentrated in the hands of a few?In conversation, Robeyns and Alfani explore the moral, political, and historical case against extreme wealth. They discuss why today&#39;s unprecedented concentration of riches poses a threat to democratic societies, how the role of the wealthy has changed over time, and whether placing limits on personal wealth could help build a fairer and more resilient society. Drawing on philosophy, economics, and history, they reflect on what inequality reveals about the kind of world we have created—and what it would take to imagine a different one.

Ingrid Robeyns & Guido Alfani on Extreme Wealth

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In this episode, we bring you a recording of a special event we hosted with economic historian Arnaud Orain, whose work offers a new perspective on the history and future of capitalism. He is joined by journalist and European affairs commentator Caroline de Gruyter, one of Europe&#39;s most perceptive observers of politics and the liberal order.The conversation took place on the occasion of the Dutch translation of Orain&#39;s book The Finitude of the World: Boundless Capitalism from the Seventeenth Century to Today. In this groundbreaking work, Orain argues that while the neoliberal promise of endless growth may have reached its limits, capitalism itself remains far from exhausted. Instead, he contends, we have entered a recurring historical phase he calls &#34;Finitude Capitalism&#34;: a form of capitalism that emerges when the world is perceived as finite and resources become objects of intensified competition, extraction, and control.Together, they discuss how this logic manifests today in the privatisation and militarisation of the seas, the rise of monopolistic and rentier forms of trade, and the growing power of private corporations that exercise quasi-sovereign authority over both physical and digital spaces. Drawing on history, political economy, and contemporary geopolitics, Orain and De Gruyter reflect on what the return of finitude means for capitalism, democracy, and the future of the global liberal order.

Arnaud Orain & Caroline de Gruyter on Finitude Capitalism

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In this episode, we bring you a recording of a conversation hosted by De Dépendance with historian Quinn Slobodian and writer and technologist Ben Tarnoff, co-authors of the new book Muskism: A Guide for the Perplexed.Quinn Slobodian is Professor of International History at Boston University and the author of Crack-Up Capitalism, Hayek&#39;s Bastards, and Globalists. Ben Tarnoff is the author of Internet for the People and co-author of Voices from the Valley, and writes extensively on technology, power, and digital politics.In conversation with journalist Nuria Ribas Costa, they explore the idea of &#34;Muskism&#34;: a political and economic logic embodied by Elon Musk but extending far beyond any single individual. Rather than treating Musk as an exceptional figure, they examine him as a symptom of a broader postliberal age, one in which technological sovereignty, private power, and visions of engineered futures increasingly shape public life.Together, they discuss the relationship between technology and state power, the appeal of techno-libertarianism, and the ways digital platforms, AI, and infrastructure are reshaping politics and society. Drawing on history, political economy, and contemporary tech culture, Slobodian and Tarnoff ask what Muskism reveals about our present moment—and the kind of future it seeks to build.

Quinn Slobodian & Ben Tarnoff on Muskism

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In this episode we are bringing you a recording of a special event we hosted with anthropologist Anna Tsing, whose work has reshaped how we think about capitalism, ecology, and life in a damaged world. Anna Tsing is Professor of Anthropology at the University of California, Santa Cruz, and Aarhus University. She is the acclaimed author of In the Realm of the Diamond Queen, Friction, and The Mushroom at the End of the World.In this conversation with journalist Nuria Ribas Costa, she explores the idea of the Patchy Anthropocene: a world of fragmented landscapes shaped by extraction, environmental crisis, and the uneven impacts of global capitalism. Together they discuss how dominant economic systems exhaust ecosystems, communities, and forms of life, while also considering the unexpected forms of coexistence that emerge in the ruins. Drawing on her research into human and more-than-human worlds, Tsing reflects on what it means to live, collaborate, and imagine futures in environments that are already profoundly altered.

Anna Tsing on the Patchy Anthropocene

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In this episode, acclaimed sociologist and Princeton professor Ruha Benjamin joins De Dépendance Podcast for a compelling conversation on the occasion of her new book, Imagination: A Manifesto. Interviewed by historian Marianne Klerk, Benjamin explores how emerging technologies—especially algorithms and AI—shape inequality, and why we must treat imagination as a powerful site of struggle and possibility. If we hope to dismantle systems shaped by white supremacy, patriarchy, capitalism, and colonialism, she argues, we must first learn to imagine the world anew.Benjamin lays out a poetic yet pragmatic vision for worldbuilding—one that invites listeners to reflect on how their everyday choices help maintain or transform the status quo. She is joined by Sennay Ghebreab, Professor of Socially Intelligent AI at the University of Amsterdam and director of the Civic AI Lab, whose work investigates how artificial intelligence can be designed in service of equity and social justice.Together, they delve into the politics of technology, the urgency of critical imagination, and the practical steps toward building fairer futures.

Ruha Benjamin on Imagination

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In this episode, political scientist and philosopher Lea Ypi joins us to discuss the ideas behind her new book Indignity: A Life Reimagined. Named one of the world’s top ten thinkers by Prospect magazine, Ypi draws on her upbringing in communist Albania to examine the intertwined questions of freedom, democracy, memory, and political change. Building on the success of her memoir Free, Indignity blends philosophy and personal history to reimagine Europe’s past—from Ottoman aristocracy to the rise of modern Albania and Greece, and from war and communism to the global financial crisis.In conversation with De Dépendance-editor Nuria Ribas Costa, Ypi reflects on what it means to survive in an age of extremes, exploring the fragile boundary between truth and narrative, fact and fiction. Together, they confront difficult questions about moral judgment, inherited histories, and what the crises of liberal democracy might teach us about our present moment.

Lea Ypi on Indignity and the Fragility of Truth

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In this episode, De Dépendance editor Hani Salih sits down with political commentator, economist, and author Grace Blakeley to delve into the ideas behind her new book Vulture Capitalism: Corporate Crimes, Backdoor Bailouts and the Death of Freedom. Blakeley argues that today’s economic, social, and democratic crises aren’t signs of a system in collapse, but the intended outcomes of a capitalist model functioning exactly as designed. From JPMorgan to Boeing, and from Henry Ford to Richard Nixon, she traces how free-market ideology has empowered corporations and undermined democracy. Together, they explore what it would take to turn the tide and reclaim control over our collective future.

Grace Blakeley on Vulture Capitalism

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In this episode, Pulitzer Prize–winning journalist and creator of The 1619 Project, Nikole Hannah-Jones, joins us for a powerful conversation on the state of American democracy. At a moment when history itself is being rewritten for political ends, Hannah-Jones reflects on how the stories a nation tells — and those it chooses to forget — shape its democratic foundations. Together with moderator Hani Salih, she unpacks the struggle over narrative, the power of memory, and what it takes to defend democracy when its core ideals are under siege.

Nikole Hannah-Jones on Democracy, Resistance and the Politics of Memory

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In this episode, we welcome Meredith Whittaker, President of the Signal Foundation and one of the world’s leading tech critics, for a powerful conversation on privacy, surveillance, and the future of technology. Whittaker, who also co-founded the AI Now Institute, shares her insights on how surveillance and AI are deeply intertwined, and how tech giants profit from large-scale data extraction. She highlights Signal as a radical alternative—a privacy-focused, non-profit messaging app that challenges the dominance of surveillance capitalism. Joined by Evelyn Austin of Bits of Freedom, Whittaker discusses how current tech infrastructures shape our lives, the urgent need for oversight in AI deployment, and what it takes to build digital tools that truly serve the public good.

Meredith Whittaker on Signal, Surveillance & AI

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In this episode, we dive into The Big Con, the provocative book by economists Mariana Mazzucato and Rosie Collington, which exposes the deep entanglement between the consulting industry and the modern management of business and government. From McKinsey to PwC, the authors argue that these firms don’t just advise—they shape policy, stifle innovation, and erode accountability. In this lecture by Rosie Colington, followed by a discussion with professor of public administration Martijn van der Steen, we unpack how decades of privatization, financialization, and risk aversion have empowered consultancies to act as unchallenged arbiters of expertise, often to the detriment of the public good. Collington calls for a bold reimagining of how we build capacity within our institutions, shifting from outsourced dependency to collective intelligence—reclaiming the promise of both democracy and innovation.

LIVE: The Big Con w/ Rosie Collington

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In this episode, we’re joined by award-winning science journalist Angela Saini to discuss her bold and timely book: The Patriarchs: How Men Came to Rule. In this interview with historian Marianne Klerk, Saini traces the deep and complex roots of patriarchy — from the world’s earliest known human settlements to modern-day societies. Drawing on cutting-edge research in archaeology, history, and science, she challenges the myth that male dominance is natural or inevitable, revealing it instead as a fragile construct that has been built, contested, and reshaped throughout history. Together, we explore how gendered inequality became entrenched across cultures, how it continues to shape our present, and why rethinking old narratives is crucial to imagining a more equal future.

LIVE: The Patriarchs: How Men Came to Rule w/ Angela Saini

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Across the world, experimental predictive algorithms are being deployed that promise to prevent welfare fraud. Now for the first time, an international team of journalists gained unprecedented access to one of these &#34;suspicion machines&#34; in the city of Rotterdam. An investigation by Lighthouse Reports, WIRED and Vers Beton demonstrates how governments all over Europe - and municipalities like Rotterdam - are deploying AI risk scoring systems in welfare fraud detection, revealing discrimination, wide-scale surveillance, and a trail of lives ruined.  In this podcast investigative journalist Gabriel Geiger (Lighthouse Reports) shares what they uncovered and discusses it with media anthropologist Miriyam Aouragh (Westminster University London) and law Professor Sofia Ranchordas (Tilburg University). Examining Rotterdam’s welfare fraud algorithm they look at the serious flaws and biases it contains, the human impact caused by its decisions, and what it reveals about the future of AI.

LIVE: The Suspicion Machine w/ Gabriel Geiger, Miriyam Aouragh & Sofia Ranchordas

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In this episode we talk to Pulitzer-Prize winning reporter Nikole Hannah-Jones on her groundbreaking 1619 Project. The 1619 Project is The New York Times Magazine’s award-winning reframing of American history that places slavery and its continuing legacy at the center of the countries’ national narrative. It offers a revealing new origin story for the United States, one that helps explain not only the persistence of anti-Black racism and inequality in American life today, but also the roots of so much of what makes the country unique. The 1619 Project speaks directly to our current moment, contextualizing the systems of race and caste that still define so much of American life today. It reveals the hidden truths around America’s founding and construction—and the way that the legacy of slavery did not end with emancipation, but continues to shape contemporary American life. And it provides important lessons and insights in relation to our own Dutch colonial past.

LIVE: The 1619 Project w/ Nikole Hannah-Jones

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In this episode we listen to a lecture by and interview with urbanist and historian Davarian L. Baldwin on the occasion of his highly acclaimed book In the Shadow of the Ivory Tower: How Universities are Plundering Our Cities. Urban universities play an important and outsized role in cities. They bring diverse ideas and people together and they generate new innovations. But they also gentrify neighbourhoods and exacerbate housing inequality in an effort to enrich campuses and attract students. They often become the main employers, dictating labour practices and suppressing wages. And they increasingly occupy real estate positions in vulnerable communities. Together with Davarian Baldwin and De Dépendance editor Farid Tabarki we will discuss the relationship between universities and our cities.  What is the role of higher education in shaping our urban environment? And how do we ensure that they actually contribute to a just and vibrant city?

LIVE: How Universities are Plundering Our Cities w/ Davarian Baldwin

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In this podcast we will listen to a lecture by Carolyn Steel, architect and author of the award-winning <a href="https://www.carolynsteel.com/hungrycitybook" rel="nofollow">Hungry City: How Food Shapes Our Lives</a> and <a href="https://www.carolynsteel.com/sitopiabook" rel="nofollow">Sitopia: How Food Can Save the World</a>. From our foraging hunter-gatherer ancestors to the enormous appetites of modern cities, food has shaped our bodies and homes, our politics and trade, and our climate. Whether it’s the daily decision of what to eat, or the monopoly of industrial food production, food touches every part of our world. But by forgetting its value, we have drifted into a way of life that threatens our planet and ourselves. Yet food remains central to addressing the predicaments and opportunities of our urban, digital age. Drawing on insights from philosophy, history, architecture, literature, politics and science, as well as stories of the farmers, designers and economists who are remaking our relationship with food, architect and writer Carolyn Steel offers a provocative and exhilarating vision for change, and how to thrive on our crowded, overheating planet.

LIVE: How Food Can Save the World w/ Carolyn Steel

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Twelve months. That is the time the world now has for global greenhouse gas emissions to start to fall. If not, we will miss the chance to avoid the worst impacts of the climate crisis. According to the 2022 report on mitigation by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) the world can still hope to stave off the worst ravages of climate breakdown, but only through a “now or never” dash to a low-carbon economy and society. Greenhouse gas emissions must peak by 2025, and should be nearly halved this decade, to give the world a chance of limiting future heating to 1.5C above pre-industrial levels. It is in effect a final warning for governments on the climate. So now what? Together with IPCC Lead Author and Professor of Socio-Technical Innovation and Climate Change Heleen de Coninck we will navigate through the latest climate science and what it should mean for our climate policies. What agency do we still have to turn things around? Could cities be the forerunners in the transformations we need? And as our planet is heating up: why are climate politics still frozen?

LIVE: Climate Politics w/ Heleen de Coninck

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In this live episode we talk to Andrea Elliott on the occasion of her Pulitzer Prize winning book &#39;Invisible Child: Poverty, Survival &amp; Hope in an American City&#39;. Elliott is an investigative journalist for The New York Times whose work documents the lives of people on the margins of power. Based on nearly a decade of reporting, Invisible Child follows eight dramatic years in the life of Dasani Coates, whose story has become emblematic of America’s most wicked and growing urban problems: segregation, poverty and systemic inequality. It reveals the reality of child homelesness in New York City, and lays bare a strata of society far too often ignored. So what can we learn from Elliott’s vivid and powerfull narrative? Joined on stage by sociologist Bowen Paulle and urban geographer Cody Hochstenbach we analyse and unpack the power structures and unequal systems within which people become trapped, and its impact upon households and communities. And we look into concrete solutions and policies to tackle the divide.

LIVE: Invisible Child w/ Andrea Elliott, Bowen Paulle & Cody Hochstenbach

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In this live edition of De Dépendance Podcast labour economist Guy Standing gives a short lecture on his book ‘The Precariat: The New Dangerous Class’. In it he provides a detailed understanding of how the situation of precarious employment affects the lives of the “Precariat”: the rapidly growing number of people facing lives of insecurity, on zero-hour contracts, moving in and out of jobs that give little meaning to their lives. Standing investigates this growing group, finding a frustrated and angry new underclass who are often ignored by politicians and economists. We have started to work more and more, and get less and less in return. But how did we end up here? And is there a way out?

LIVE: The Precariat w/ Guy Standing

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In this live edition of De Dépendance Podcast we listen to a short lecture by journalist Sarah Jaffe on her book Work Won’t Love You Back – How Devotion to Our Jobs Keeps Us Exploited, Exhausted and Alone. The last decade has seen a seismic shift in attitudes towards work and the idea of labour. Whether it is through the rise of the gig economy, the rapid proliferation of the new creator economy, or the pandemic-induced break from traditional office culture: work has seeped into our private lives, literally invading our homes. Meanwhile, more and more of us are pushed to make sacrifices for the privilege of being able to do work we enjoy. It has led to the idea that certain work is not really work, and should be done for the sake of passion rather than pay. So what is wrong with this ‘labour of love’ myth? And how can we fundamentally transform our perceptions of work?

LIVE: Work Won't Love You Back w/ Sarah Jaffe

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In this special live edition of De Dépendance Podcast we listen to a short lecture by sociologist Bowen Paulle on one of the most pressing social issues of our time: educational inequality. In the past education has long served the function of being the &#39;great equaliser&#39;: not your origin or social class, but your talent and effort would determine your level of schooling and future prospects in society. But this engine of emancipation is grinding to a halt. Where you are born and the educational level of your parents increasingly determines the opportunities you get in life. And this growing inequality of opportunity tends to perpetuate or even reinforce itself: it stops intergenerational mobility. So what to do? What are the best practices, scalable solutions and concrete policies to tackle the current divide? And who should take the lead?

LIVE: Educational Inequality w/ Bowen Paulle

De Dépendance Podcast addresses the complex issues of our time and how they manifest themselves in our cities and urban regions. We are based in the city of Rotterdam, the Netherlands which – as Europe’s biggest port - is intrinsically connected to global trends and transformations. In order to critically reflect on these, we will be interviewing writers, scholars, and thought leaders.