How To Measure The Value of NFTs
43m | Nov 12, 2021The Elevator Pitch For Value
Welcome back to The Long Run Show. Today we are going to talk about how to value your investments.
Starting with a rather philosophical definition of value, hosts Austin and Mike go through techniques to value the new retail investment tools such as NFTs, and MEMEs.
#META,#NFT,#MEME,#VALUE
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NOT FINANCIAL ADVICE
The Information Contained on this Podcast is not intended as, and shall not be understood or construed as, financial advice
Unedited Transcript:
Welcome back to the long run show. This is Austin Wilson coming to you with Michael O'Connor. Hello, today, we are going to talk about value. What is value? Why do you buy it? How do we quantify it is qualitative all of the above to do with value. Uh, this is going to be a little bit more of a philosophical episode, uh, but I think it's important to understand.
Kind of the, the philosophical, the mindset, the theory, if you will, around the wiring. Not quite, but that too. We can talk about that. So we're going, gonna dive into everything from crypto alternative investments to stocks, bonds, all of it. And how. Do we value it? Why do we value it? Why invest almost. So it's going to be a bit of a meta episode here, but I hope you'll hope you like it.
So to get things kicked off here, Mike, um, I'm just going to ask you, what is. Ooh, that's a, quite the opening salvo there, Austin. Uh, well, let's see, ready go. The elevator pitch of what is value, sell me on value. Sell me on value, not value investing, which again, that's something we can, we can talk about it here too.
Like value investing, growth investing. I've never really understood the difference to be honest, but, but initially value. What, what is value when we say value? Y what are we, what do we mean? Yeah. At the end of the day, value is a, it's hard to pin down because it it's, it describes so many things in so many different ways.
I think the best way to do it is something like you said, take almost a philosophical approach and step back and try and try and look at what the first principles of value could be. Um, I think that value is a way of. Quantifying what something means in relation to either, you know, uh, the economist of me would say, you know, a utility or a perceived value is kind of also floating around there of, you know, there's this, the element that it is a, a construct of the mind in one way or another, because different people can assign different values to different things.
But at the same time there, I think there is an objectiveness to value that something that has a use or a, some sort of actionable, actionable ability to it that improves either quality of life or survivability. I mean, if you want to get down to the very deep level of, you know, what is the value of food or water or shelter.
And this the, the classic, you know, would you rather have diamonds or water in a desert if you're going to die? So it's a, you know, value depends on the environment that you're in. It depends on the situation that you're in. Depends on how you perceive the things that you're trying to value, but. I mean, without going too far down the rabbit hole there, I think in the average day-to-day life of both of us and in people who are listening and investors all over the globe and especially in United States, I think value is pretty out of our hands in a lot of ways.
I think it's, it seems to be assigned in a lot of ways. And I think that's how a lot of people perceive things. Like if a shirt is. $30 at the clothing store, but it's suddenly, it's 50% off you say, wow, I've got a great deal. Like that's great value, even though maybe the, to make it, it was only a dollar, you know?
So there's, I think there is a, an ideology that value is in some ways assigned in some ways out of the hands of any individual player, um, So there's that kind of value that exterior value that is almost imposed on us and our experiences by exterior forces, but then there's also interior value, you know, how you value a specific NFT painting perhaps, or a different, different things.
So, Well, that was a lot to, a lot to say that it's, it's complicated. It's difficult to pin down. I think. Yeah, it depends on the context. Alright. Talking for a while. So I want to hear, yeah, no, no. So, okay. So, so I think we can both agree that it's complex. So let me try to simplify it. And maybe I'm going to be jumping off a cliff here into the sea of complexity, but my springboard is.
The, in this kind of formulator, as you were trying to put words to what is value. I think I'm going to offer this as a, as a definition of what is value and as a value is the price. Someone is willing to pay to control something. Hmm. So I think that's a. Possibly flawed definition. So I'm willing to willing, willing for you to poke holes in it.
But I think that really sums up the mechanism, which is priced that we use. Now. I think there is a flaw in that because in my background in marketing, we'd always. We are always thinking, I don't always approach things as, okay. There's a certain amount of value that this product or service provides. But then my job as a marketer is to increase the perceived value and sometimes the actual value of the product or service by positioning it correctly by explaining it well.
And clearly it's simply. I don't know that price is exactly correlated to value, but I think it's a helpful tool to understand value. And I think price is the defacto interpretation of value for everything. Okay. Diamonds and water, and they might be priced differently in the desert versus in the jeweler shop.
Right? So you're making the water for free and you might get the diamonds for millions of dollars in the jewelry shop, and it might be the complete opposite in the desert. You might get the diamonds for free and you might have to pay millions for the water. So I think. The everything you said is true that contextual, the context matters at all.
The, all the externalities, I just kind of value is sort of figured out for us almost a lot of the time. Um, a lot of the times, it's not because in the, in the example you were giving of the shirt, you could go in there and barter for it technically, and you could get a deal on that, but it could be at the price that you.
Correct in your perception of the value of that? Sure. So I think there is, um, mind mindset there around value as well, but it's that it's possibly fixed or that it's, um, figured out for us by some external force, uh, when maybe we have a little bit more control over it. Um, or, you know, for instance, a stock, you don't have to buy it at 67.
You can buy it at 43. Or, or you can have your price target set at 43 and wait for it to go back down to 43. Maybe it doesn't go back down. Okay. But that's the value you put on it. And there's, there's a, I guess, I guess maybe I'm going into a bit more mindset around value, but that's the value you place on it and it's not worth it to you at 67.
So I think there's some, um, some wiggle room there on. External nature of how value is determined for some thing, whether it's a stock, a shirt, diamonds or water. Yeah. I think that's a, an important recognition. So it's, it is interesting though, to me. And you mentioned NFTs earlier, it is interesting to me that we have a whole brave new world of different things for the average retail investor to buy and.
Some of them are investments and some of them are complete memes or jokes. So, so it's, it's interesting to me because I think what we're seeing in the last five years really is a testing of what the traditional rules around value hub. Um, how, how are things perceived and valued is being really is, is really being called into question, I think with the advent of cryptocurrencies and NFTs.
And I'm not saying these things aren't valuable, I'm just saying they're so different. You can't apply fundamental analysis to an NFT. There's no PE ratio to an NFT, right? You're not buying future cash flows with an NFT. You're not even buying. Future interest payments with an NFT, like a, like a bond, right?
So there it's a totally, totally different. Um, and yes, of course there's been art. You could buy art, but that's been locked off for, uh, Uh, an elite group of investors for a long time. Um, so this is, is really, I think coming this, this value discussion is really, is really valuable because it's, it's coming into the mainstream for retail investors who may have a thousand bucks to throw it on NFT and they want to want to figure out how to value it.
Right? Hmm. I think that's a great point. Cause it, the, the increase in options. What to do with your money or your time, or which I think time has been the biggest with the internet. There's an increase in options of what to do with your time. And the money side is kind of catching up there now, cryptocurrencies and FTS and all sorts of things that are native to the digital economy that, you know, the, the money side is kind of catching up.
Um, that's an interesting point. Yeah. There, there has been, uh, and, and with the cryptocurrencies, I've heard it explained as a protocol that actually pays the people who build the protocol. Hmm. Yeah. Like unlike email fair. I mean, there's a lot of developers that built email and never got paid for what it was worth.
Yeah. So that maybe, maybe, maybe that technology is, is actually helping us. Um, Distribute not distributed. I don't like that word there, but maybe, um, quantify and reward. People with value who actually deserve it. Um, which is an interesting, interesting discussion. Yeah. Because I mean, that, that brings up a whole devil's advocate situation of, you know, does that mean that something that's doesn't have a price isn't valuable and you know, that's something that like I would consider email to be valuable, but you could, I mean, you could argue that you're paying an internet fee for, for cable, internet, Ethan at whatever.
Phone line or whatever. So you're paying some sort of it make some sort of fee, but the value of individual services, how do you assign that for a free thing through email or something? True? Well, I would say everything technically does have a price. I'm going to go economist on you here because you do have a time yeah.
A time cost to it. Right. So everything does have a price. Um, and, and that's even that goes to the individual to apply. Value to it because they're going to spend a certain amount of time using email or not using email or figuring out, figuring it out or not figuring it out. I just discovered you could do folders and cheat.
Now this year welcome to 2021 Austin, but it's amazing. So, you know, you're, you're, there's a time component as well. So I think that helps with, with, uh, applying a quote unquote price. That is an interpretation of the value of a free thing. Yeah. Yeah. That's I like that definition because then it leaves, it leaves room for a more comprehensive definition of value because this definitely been people who argue that, you know, you can't cryptocurrency doesn't have a value because it's, it's, it's a serial, it's a theory on the theory.
It's, you know, it's something that is. Necessarily, I mean the whole, the whole digital gold Bitcoin argument slash kind of debate, I think is really interesting because, you know, you have a situation where, how do you define what an equivalent measure of Bitcoin is to a covenant measure of gold because you could, you know, 10 years ago, you'd just say, oh, one Bitcoin is let's, let's say whatever Bitcoin was about the same price as.
You can say, oh, okay. So Bitcoin is a, it's a digital gold. It's about the same price per ounces per coin. There's some sort of semblance of. Almost a, almost a similar to like a consumer basket where like the fed will often release reports of, uh, this basket of goods, you know, milk, bread, gasoline, whatever, which always puts a picture in my mind of an economist, going to a store with a picnic basket and picking out things and putting it in his basket and then measuring it.
I don't know why. I'm pretty sure they actually that's actually how it started. I'm almost positive that that's legitimate. Well, they would do originally economists they're literally one basket of goods and they just measure it. But anyways,
it's a, it's funny too, to see the difference between something like that. And I think, I think a lot of people maybe fall into the mindset or maybe the trap of considering. Everything is a basket considering, um, everything directly in relation to other things that are more easily experienced. Um, what do you mean by that?
So I would actually say that this is, I would say this is one of the reasons why. You know, still, I believe it's less than 50% of the U S population has any kind of investments or any kind of, um, stock. I don't, I think bonds included cryptocurrency is still at like 3% adoption. What do you mean no one wants to buy a bond, especially right now.
Exactly. Exactly. I think this ties into why, so. I mean, the numbers are far lower, pretty much everywhere else in the world. I believe there may be some exceptions to that, but I think that these, the, it, there is a difficulty in looking at something in tangible, like a portfolio of stocks and making the, making the leap from, you know, the value of my money can get me these things XYZ, and maybe not even physical things, you know, it could be.
A subscription service to Netflix or something. There's, there's a difference between that kind of value, um, that is very easily experienced and then a value that takes more time to experience or you can't even directly experience. And I think taking. Into that zone is, is a, is a challenge for the human mind as a, as a, as an object.
But I mean, I think it's an important leap to make. I think that's the part of the partly the main difference between something like physical gold and Bitcoin is that there is a leap there, um, that you can't really, there's no way around it, that there is an inherent difference. Uh, In the substance of the thing, you know, the gold at the end of the day, even if you just have gold ETFs or, you know, you just hire someone else to store your gold, you still know it's there.
You still know that there is hopefully, hopefully through there there's some, there's a lot more paper. Yeah, fine. Yes. I know what you mean. There, there's a, there's a leap of like, oh, I know I could touch this too. Yeah. What is Bitcoin? I can't touch that. I can't hold it. Yeah. Yeah. Then again, you might as well argue that it's the same thing with a dollar, except we can touch the paper.
Yeah. But the value of the dollar. Is an inherent to the paper that we're touching. So we're not actually really, it's almost a, it's almost a smoke and mirrors drink at that point. And again, I'm not trying to much out there listening to us. I'm not trying to try to be a, you know, be a conspiracy there's here.
That's what I'm trying to do. But, but it is interesting because, okay, you're, you're saying there's a physical element to something like, or, or an experiential element to something like. Amazon prime or Disney plus, right where you actually experience it versus, oh, I own Google stock or, oh, I own, I own, um, let's say.
And it doesn't really do anything or it goes down and it's like, okay, well there's not really much happening here. Right. And so that's harder thing to experience or it takes time to experience like what I just said. You have to have time for it to go down or go up, hopefully affordable backup, but that's a whole nother discussion.
I listened to our electric vehicles episodes coming up. Uh, I think that's a great point. Time the, the, the component of time in terms of value is extremely important. I would say, because like you said, the some values you can't really experience outside of time. If you look at interest rates. Yeah. That's, that's a perfect example, right there, it's a wild, a wild aspect of, of values that, that there is really inherently in a, as an a majority.
Of things, there is some sort of time value. Like there is always the possibility that something could be less valuable or more valuable. Um, even just in the exact same location, don't have to be in the desert or a jewelry shop, you know, like there's, there's a, a inextricable connection to time in so many different things that.
I think it's easy to, to not look at the long run sometimes. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And I think probably value makes a lot more sense in conjunction with time, which means you really need to look at it over the long run, um, because that'll help you understand, you know, what, what you're looking at and what you're trying to value there.
So I think that's a, that's definitely an important element and it all wraps into the context of broader umbrella of contexts. The value that matters. But, but I think it's important here. Let's drill, drill into a couple of different, um, I guess asset classes, if you will, different different things you can buy as investments.
Okay. So we've got. Things like cryptocurrencies, which we've already talked about. We've got things like NFTs, um, kind of tied together there. We've got things like Vino vest, which, which is, uh, for those who don't know is a, um, a wine investment platform where you can invest in fine wines for pretty reasonable minimum.
Um, and they have their own Vino vest, 100 index, right? Kinda like the NASDAQ 100, right. Or the Dow Jones. There, there are those kinds of alternatives, if you will. I don't even, I don't even know what to apply to crypto cause it's not really, I don't know. I guess it is sort of an alternative, but it seems to be correlated to the stock market.
Anyways, I digress. Then you have stocks, which you're buying equity in a business, and then you have bonds which are buying debt and future payments. So there's cash flows at you're buying with stocks. You're buying. Ownership in a business, which is most likely going to translate into some sort of future cash flows and the form of revenue and profits.
So those so stocks and bonds, we've got a pretty easy way to quantify the value there. Um, so. Coins, uh, at currency cryptos, some cryptocurrencies you can stake. So there's an interest component, but others, you can't there's like Bitcoin. I mean, there's no staking with Bitcoin. Never will be it's proof of work blockchain.
So there's, I mean, maybe you can. Lend it out for interest. Um, but that's true. You can't, you can't, uh, you there's no future cash flows. So like Bitcoin, how do you value that? Or an NFT? It's just a piece of artwork and everybody can technically see it, which I still don't understand, but it's just a piece of artwork.
It's even fine. Art. How do you value that? Right. So I guess it is. Something that you, you ask, what is someone willing to pay for? It? It goes, which goes back to our original, original proposition, but original Def definition. But how does someone value those things that we don't really have? A framework for it, like cryptos or NFTs or wine fine wine.
Or if you're holding a, a bottle of really nice Macallan 20 year or whatever, right. Fine whiskey investing. How do, how do we put understand the value associated with those things? Because I think that's important as investors. Yeah. I think there's an interesting tie in. To those kinds of things that are difficult to value and stocks that maybe have low volume and you see really weird, like wild jumps in the price, because I think it's similar.
It's, there's sometimes there, there are difficulties in finding other people who value things similarly, and sometimes it, you know, maybe it just takes time. Like maybe you buy an NFT for a thousand dollars and you list it for 2000. Maybe it never happens, but maybe it takes a year. Maybe it takes a week.
Um, but it seems like there are definitely things that have lower liquidity. And that almost seems to be a very important factor in value is the liquidity, the willingness, I mean, and then the liquidity is just the willingness of other people to engage in that transaction. So it is a stock that, you know, there's no volume.
No, one's really buying it. Sometimes I'll just see a big. And it's like, well, no one, no one really wants to buy it. So it was the value. Like, let's say it was $10 on Monday and there's almost this very low volume. And then on Tuesday it just suddenly drops to like $7. Was the value objectively $10 on Monday and objectively $7 on Tuesday.
You know, that's kind of a weird market dynamic. And then it's, well, it's one of the individual's subjective values. So it's a whole, it's a whole, there's a, there's a whole wild game context manager. Yeah, it is. I think you've hit on something really interesting with any of the things that we buy as investors.
We're looking to make money. Otherwise we wouldn't buy it clearly, but we all buy for different reasons and it takes two to tango, at least. So it takes more than yourself. That's a great point to make a market. So. Realistically, it takes more than yourself to have value on something. Uh, when it, when it comes to an investment, obviously there's some intangible value that we're not talking about here, but, but when it comes to an investment, it takes two to tango.
You got to have more than one to understand, I guess that's the price discovery component of the market to understand the value of that investment or that asset I should say. And ideally, I mean, yeah, that, that naturally. Should create a situation where both parties receive some sort of subjective value from the exchange.
So that's like the beauty of free markets, at least in my opinion, is that really, at the end of the day, you know, a business providing a service, apple, selling an iPhone, Tesla, selling cars, it should all be providing benefit for, for both parties, which is such a unique, you know, you're not just taking a slice of the pie, you're making a bigger pie.
No, that's true. I mean, really the, the. Act of. And understanding the value of the P the price discovery, right? The very act of that increases the pie because then each person is being compensated for that price discovery, whether it's, they're buying the asset or the, or the service, I guess if in your example, or they're receiving payment for that in some form or another yeah.
Or some, some exchange there. Yeah. That is, that is interesting because without that, without the price discovery. Yeah. The value there. Um, you wouldn't have the exchange and therefore you'd be one less. You'd have one less, I guess, exchange that happened. So therefore the pie is one less exchange smaller if that made any sense.
But that, that is really interesting because it does take more than one person. And so maybe that's why value is so hard to define because it's. Maybe that, and maybe maybe value and the definition for value is just a medium of exchange and interaction, which is so we're getting, we're distilling so far down.
We really do sound like philosophers here. So I apologize to the, uh, the down to earth among you who are listening. But, um, I think that that might really be it. I mean, the value is the exchange that happens between the two people. That's really interesting because ultimately the, the value, you know, unless, unless you're at the exact same value, which I think is almost never happens.
I mean, this, I don't think there's any way to quantify that. I value that shirt at $25. You value it as you'd rather have exactly the $25. Yeah. I think there's always a give and take. There's always a, a value exchange that should leave both parties better. I mean, the, of course. Yeah, there are definitely some predatory tactics and misinformation we use.
But, but I think in the, in the moment of the exchange is when, I mean, like you said, the value is itself that in that moment of exchange. Okay. So to drill down even further, hopefully we're not beating a dead cow. Here is the value. Created in the exchange or is it inherent in the goods that are, that's a really good question.
I mean, that's, that's a really good splitting hairs. However, I think it might be, might be interesting to explore that. I think ultimately, I, I think it is created in the exchange because if, if, if the value is inherent in the object, then it, I guess, value isn't necessarily to be a value isn't necessarily communal.
Because if he could, if you can, if you can personally create value, because I think, I think, I guess the, the important distinction would be then, you know, what are, what, what do you describe things that you yourself. Engage in that you value. So there's, there's almost a, the value of things you are. Let's say you let's let's let's think of a very simple example.
Let's say you, yeah. Let's say you cut down a tree and you. On your property. And then we go farther, farther back, but let's say reminds a tree, a micro economics, 1 0 1 analogy for an externality, but let's say you cut down a tree, um, and you carve it up into some, a chair. Let's say you carve it in a chair at the end of the day, there is value created by that action because.
Unless you don't value the chair unless you're like, this is a terrible chair, I'm just gonna throw it away. So there, there is. There's the possibility for whatever you value that ad, but then when you let's say you exchange it, I think that's when I think that's when the value is created rather than utilized.
I would almost just distinct, I dunno, lay a distinction of when the, the activity creates the value. It's it's not necessarily. Value creation in the market setting. It's it's value utilization, like your, your you're spending, you're spending some sort of input to create an output of, of some sort of utility to yourself.
But I think value, I don't dunno. I like your definition of value that it's, it's a communal process. It's an activity. So I think the value creation happens when. There is another actor and there is an exchange, but I want to, I want to hear your thoughts on that. I, this, this might be a cop out, but I almost think that Val, the value is, and I, I think you were here when you made the distinction between utilization and created.
I think it is both inherent to the object and created in the exchange because. If there wasn't some value to the object, there wouldn't be an exchange. Hmm. So I think it has to be both and, um, which, which makes sense. Um, and two, I think what makes that difficult is. Um, you may VAT and this is why some deals don't happen as you may, you may have created this value in, in some object or some offering.
You bring it to the exchange. However, the other person doesn't perceive it as much as at, as high, a level of value as you have created in your mind. So then the exchange doesn't happen, but there's still value there. There's some value attached to the. Right. Um, so that's a good point. That's what I think has to be both.
Um, and I think you, you made a good point about it being utilized versus being created. I think the utilization is it happens in the exchange portion and the creation happens whenever that is whenever that object is refined. So a stock goes IPO or a. Pick nugget of gold gets mined from the ground or a car comes off the line or a phone hits the store shelf, then it, then it has value.
And then an exchange happens when someone buys it almost, it's almost like primary offering versus secondary series a and series B. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. Because then, you know, the, because in the exchange, there is the creation of more value, but it's not necessarily the, the, the onus of the initial value.
It's not. The first, first mover. Yes, indeed. Okay. So, but how does it, how does this affect our portfolio? Exactly. I think we got, we got real philosophical. So those of you that like, uh, like philosophy, I hope you're still with us. Um, those of you that don't, I hope you're still with us. I really hope you're still with us.
Um, but yeah, when it comes to our portal, First question I have, and we don't have to go super deep into this, but what's the difference between value investing in growth investing? I have heard the distinction between the two and I've never found it helpful because it always seems to confuse the heck out of me.
I've tried to explain it to people. Um, and, and I've also watched others try to explain it to people and. It is always confusing. It's always just a confusing mess and, and everyone at the, at some point, everyone just acquiesces and starts nodding their heads and say, yes, I understand. Just to end the conversation.
So value versus growth. We hear this all the time. Value stocks, growth stocks. Oh, it's the time of the value stock. We heard that earlier in 2021 at the 2020. Um, what is the, what, is there a difference? Should there be a difference? Is that just a dumb delineation? We throw it out. That's a fair. I will say that like, like you said, I'm definitely.
I've heard different, different definitions of different ways to explain it. At least for me and for my portfolio, how I invest, how I engage in the marketplace, I consider value investing to be more of a quantitative endeavor. So if I see a stock that, you know, there's some sort of, I also think it's time to time, at least for me as well, because I think value investing for me is more like, okay, I see a stock.
I really think should be hired price or if I'm going to short at lower price. And I think that there's, you know, there's, there's a definitive, there's a definitive difference in where the price or the kind of market assigned value is and where the more, more correct. I guess the more, uh, More technical value could be, you know, if you're doing technical analysis, but I think it's also more of a short-term thing.
Like it's something for me where I'm thinking value investing, I'm thinking, okay. I think this is going to correct in, I don't know, the next three to six months and I'm going to engage in this transaction. Not necessarily for. The ability to own the stock, but B because I think that the price is going to change because I think that, um, there will be a correction in the value, whereas for a growth stock or a growth kind of investment, I would consider something that I'm more interested in the long-term that I believe in the underlying innovation or activities or the, the, something about.
The stock or investment makes sense on a longer term that I'm not, I'm not just seeing that the technicals are undervalued. I don't necessarily think there might be a big price correction anytime soon, but I think that the. The time horizon for it is such that I believe that it's going to grow in value rather than correct, or, or, um, or quickly change in value.
So at least for me, a value stock is, is more short term. It's more associated with technicals and what I actually, I guess I say even better diminishes for me, a value stock is associated with what I can perceive about it right now at any given instant time. Um, that I see right now, This looks undervalued.
Whereas a growth stock is more qualitative and more, you know, maybe I don't see the price going up right now. Maybe I don't see the value right now, but I believe, and according to research, I have decent enough reason to believe, not just, uh, not just blind faith and a stock, but an actual reason to believe that the price will grow rather than simply.
So that's, that's how I approach it, but I want to, I want to hear your thoughts on that and how you approach value and growth. I mean, since I was the one that answered the, or ask the question, I typically don't use value and growth as a, as a measurement. Um, but, or as a delineation or a. I guess category, um, to segment different stocks into, cause I just haven't found it helpful, but your definitions are actually very helpful.
Um, and make a little bit more sense when it comes to using the term. So I might, I might use those in the future, I guess, value, I guess to me was more long-term in my mind. Um, which is odd because I guess I'm thinking, okay, well something's on sale and it's. It's a good business, then I would buy it and that's value, but it's almost like you're, you're kind of taking the approach of, well, this is just.
Not at the correct price right now. It doesn't really matter if it's fundamentally a sound business. It just, it could be a really bad business model, but they have more assets than their current market cap or something like that. Right. It, it there's some discrepancy there. Um, so I think that's helpful. I think the time component is also helpful.
Interesting to see growth stocks turn into value stocks. Like we may eventually see the apple or Google. Oh, that's now a value stock, right? Like that, that could be turning in. It could be at some point they level off and there's a price discrepancy there. Um, so that's an interesting, interesting, uh, I dunno, I guess, uh, future thought there.
Um, as far as portfolio wise, I typically have looked for. Things I've taken, typically taking a value. Lens to buying, but I also am guilty of just using ETFs a lot that are broad index ETFs. Um, I have recently bought a more individual stocks and actually. I've been playing around in, in shipping you over the last couple of weeks here.
And they've been part of the crazy meteoric rise of the ship. It's a real question of value, right there. It is a real question of value right there, which I believe it does have better value than doge coin as a, as a crypto. But, um, where do we don't need to go down the rabbit hole? Um, but in, in that aspect I've been picking different entry points based on.
Where I think things are headed and where recent levels, I haven't been doing exact technical analysis, but where recent w levels have, uh, have kind of produced themselves, levels of, of support really have produced themselves based on past spikes. So there've been three pretty big spikes. Um, I've kind of played off those as I see some sort of consolidation around a support level happen, like, okay, this is my time to enter, to prepare for the next one.
Um, now with that, I'm, I'm, that's more of a catalyst trade, right? I'm kind of waiting for the Robin hood thing to either fizzle out in which. That's not a positive catalyst on the horizon or to happen in which case that's a huge part of catalyst, which can have amazing, amazing effects on the, on the price, uh, movement of, of Sheba.
So I think that's, I think that's a good example of, okay. I guess I'm looking at, uh, I'm looking for value in the short. At different price targets. So I think of, I think I'm taking more of a value approach to my entry points. Um, and, and not so much to the stock over all or the asset overall. Does that makes no, that does make sense.
Cause I think that, I think that's similar to how I approach it in that the value comes from the price rather than the underlying value, which ironically is. Opposite of what we've been talking about, but I think that, well, no, I think that the price is, I think the price is a tool to interpret the value of the, of the underlying asset.
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. we're going to talk about, and what we just talked about for 20 minutes, we didn't waste their time. Like we didn't waste their time here, man. My brain hurts. Yeah, exactly. I think, uh, I think that is true though. The price is. A tool to understand the value. Can change minute by minute with something like shimmy, you know, but, um, it could change very quickly, but you can also play off of that.
So I think that's something important to, uh, to keep in mind when you're, when you're thinking about your portfolio. And obviously this is investment advice, although I think you'd have a hard time construing any of this as investment advice, because we sound more like philosophers, but at any rate, throw that out there and not, not terribly good philosophy.
So I, um, yeah, as far as portfolios, I think it's important to think about the entry price. And I also think Mike, your definition of value and growth is definitely value in growth. Stocks is definitely more. Yeah. Valuable. No, no, no, no useful. It was not going to save valuable is more useful, provides more utility to the, to the average investor.
I'm glad I could exchange that to you. Oh goodness. Well, I think we better let, uh, let these folks go. We have to go. So appreciate you listening today. Um, if you could definitely hit, hit us up, give us a five stars there. Leave a review. Um, also we are on LinkedIn as well. I know that's the weirdest way to connect, but that's how we connect.
Okay. We're we're not, we're not one of those fast paced Twitter hounds. We are here for the long run. We're we're willing to connect with you and be around, have, have long lasting relationships. Over the long run on LinkedIn. So here's up there. We're happy to connect and have, uh, have conversations and further discussion around value.
Give us ideas what to talk about too. We would welcome those as well. All right. This has been the long run show. I'm Austin, and I'm like, hopefully we'll see you next time.
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